I had a great chat with Carole Theriault about social engineering and how I see cybersecurity for most companies. We covered fishing rods in prisons, helicopters in hospitals and government teepees. Carole is a brilliant interviewer and very kindly describes it as "truly mind-opening". I hope you enjoy listening to the two-parter.

If you're not familiar with Hacking Humans on Cyberwire, it's a great podcast. As well as my interviews, these two episodes cover some really interesting stories including a sophisticated bank scam here in the UK and the criminal use of steganography in memes as a command and control technique.

Part One in episode 30 of Hacking Humans: "At some point you're probably going to have to do some running"

Part Two in episode 31 of Hacking Humans: "Trained humans are your strongest link"